Re: Questions
Posted by LGsinmyheart on Thursday, July 24 2008 at 03:07:38amIn reply to Questions posted by [Unregistered Poster] on Tuesday, July 22 2008 at 11:16:37pm
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Hello! First anything, you have to understand my (and anyone else’s) mistrust or hostility. Some of what you say and ask might be provocative or polemic among ourselves. Some of that is also too reminiscent of the customary attacks we have received from antis here and elsewhere, even if that wasn’t your intention (and I recognise that you have been polite so far and appreciate it). That said, I have no reason to deny you my answers. And even if you don’t move an inch, it’s never a bad idea to do some exercise in thinking about oneself, and it’s also a good thing to post things like this on GC because others will also read it, not just the person it was originally addressed at. 3.- I'm sorry if there're grammar mistakes. English is not my first language. You’d probably be surprised to know how many non-natives we have on GC. In any case, it’s never been a barrier. You’ll be excused. When I was about eight, an unknown man tried to make me go into his car […] These two episodes have been in my mind since then and I still can't understand why someone can be sexually attracted to a little girl. It is no wonder that those episodes were scary and I can see how they have left a profound impression. But you have to see that you are stereotyping a whole group of people for the actions of a few. I have been mugged a few times. I have been co-target of an attempted bomb attack once. The responsible for all of that were men, yet I don’t thereby assume that all men are muggers or terrorists. I am not trying to downplay your experience. I am only saying that you cannot extrapolate from the behaviour of two people into a group that is too large to even be able to know everyone else. You said you never again talked to strangers – but were ever all strangers as creepy as that one?? I sincerely doubt it. Why did they have to be punished for someone that someone else did?? I have to admit that I do have the temptation to tell you to “get over it”, because both incidents seem to have been a lot of time ago and seem to have had no lasting, material effect in your real life. To put an analogy that is not entirely adequate but shows my point: children who have never seen actual violence might be shocked and scared when they see, for instance, a multiple, gruesome, bloody car accident with lots of blood and death. But unless they themselves or someone they know was part of it, it doesn’t have any direct effect on their own real life, and, after a time of learning how to deal, it shouldn’t leave a lifelong mark. Both your incidents seem, to me, to belong in this category. But I am not here to preach – you will deal as your heart tells you. I just think you’re putting too much weight into something that had little practical effect. When I see one of them, I just think of princesses and cardboard castles, tea parties, playing with mom's make-up and things like that. Me too. I just see an erotic aspect to it that obviously other people don’t. You know, this is hard to explain. Obviously there is a sort of gulf of understanding – it’s as hard for you and many others to understand an attraction to children as much as it’s hard for many of us to understand an attraction to adults. And you don’t even need to go that far – sometimes it’s hard for those attracted to one gender to understand those attracted to the other. But all of the things you mentioned, and many other things that I can think of that are unmistakably associated with little girls, 1) I am not denying any of them and 2) I am not even saying they are somehow uninteresting or boring. I am just saying that I think those are sexy things. I find all of those girlish activities to be fun, to be cute, and at the same time to be celebrating and affirming of life and all its wonders, and of the joys and pleasures of being a little girl. I find girlhood to be a time of dreams and ideals, of curiosity and exploration, of imagination and ingenuity. And I find those qualities to be of an unmatched erotic appeal, an appeal that I cannot generally find in any other demographic. I thought about it a thousand times but I still can't understand why anybody would be aroused by them, they're so tiny and fragile, an adult would hurt them if s/he tried anything sexual with them. First, tiny and fragile might just be qualities that some of us find sexy. I don’t know why, but for instance, Gulliver’s little girl character Glumdalclitch is, as a character, one of the most interesting little girls I’ve ever read, and a wonderful girl to meet. But, even in literature, I can’t go past the fact that she is a giant. I really have no rational way to argue this point. It’s just that the same way some people like taller or fatter people (ie, bigger people), I like the “tiny and fragile” package. I don’t think it makes me worse, either. If anything, it puts a harder burden to look after such a package. And yes, I think it’s very sexy to, for instance, cuddle her and carry her away from danger. Which only a tiny and fragile package can achieve. You don’t mention which your mother tongue is (and neither am I asking) but if it’s French, this is excellently described in Renaud’s song “Morgane de toi”: T’es la seule gonzesse que j’ peux tenir dans mes bras And second, (and you’re probably going to get some fire for having said that) this is one of the most common misunderstandings regarding us. When we say sex, you probably think of the rough and violent scenes of any sex-shop video. Well we don’t. Of course if an adult attempts the penis penetration of a small child, it will cause pain and probably internal wounds. But that’s hardly what we mean when we say sex. I won’t go into discussing my fantasising unless I get convinced it’s absolutely necessary – but I am sure if it was legal I would be able to satisfy and be satisfied by a little girl without resorting to “adult” sex. They don't even understand sex yet! *please, don't try to prove me wrong on this point, I have a niece who's 6 and I know for a fact she doesn't understand what it is* First, like in the first example, you cannot extrapolate to every other little girl. I can believe you that she doesn’t know anything. It doesn’t prove that no little girl knows anything. Admittedly, I haven’t met any 6 year old I would regard as “sexually aware”. But I have an 8 year old – does that count? Second (and this is not your mistake as much as it is society’s), there is no reason why “understanding” or “knowing” should be, as such, a prerequisite for engaging in sexual activity. I really don’t see why it should go any further than whether it feels good or bad, right or wrong, pleasurable or painful. If you intend to answer talking about pregnancies, fertility is very rarely an issue before 10 years for girls and 11 for boys, and obviously is not for intra-gender activity. If you intend to answer talking about STDs, it is very easy to teach against fluid exchange, and that goes further than just sexual activity, by the way. Third, there should be some form of sexual education as early as for every other life subject. Obviously you will teach different things to different ages; there’s no arguing that. But by age 6 she should certainly know something about how her body works, how to defend from possible abuse, and basics about risks involved – because by age 6, even if your niece isn’t, there are a lot of girls and boys that are experimenting with each other. Reading this board, I have to say I'm scared of letting her go out of my sister's house anymore. I'm sorry but things like "OMG! That 8 year-old girl is HOT!" or "I saw a LG wearing a dress and she was wearing white cotton panties, nice view!" scare me. A LOT. With this I'm not saying you should go to jail or anything like that, in case you're just talking about it or thinking about it. But I can't help to be scared of it. I hope knowing the answer to my questions can take the fears away or, at least, make them smaller. I can see why you could be scared of reading this sort of things. But you have to understand that there is a universe of difference between those thoughts or statements and even trying to so much as speak to the girl, much less trying to get into her pants, and least of all forcing your way into her pants. And this is not very different from what you can hear from the adult-attracted either. Men and women alike, attracted to theirs and the other gender alike, say the same kind of things among friends of their orientation and sometimes even others outside their orientation (depending on their level of comfort with that, of course). The thought or the comment does not make anyone a threat to their desired person. People, or at least the majority of them, know there are limits and which they are. Paedophiles are no different in it. - Why do you think you're attracted to LG? Please, don't answer that with "Just because" or "Why are you attracted to men/women?" because I can answer that. I really want a truthful answer to this one. Well, it is hard to say. Or rather, hard to convey the meaning of what I am saying to someone who is not attracted to them. I will again bring an adult analogy. Once, during a long car trip, there was two friends of mine, a gay man, a mostly straight woman, and me. For some reason, the talk turned to what the gay man “saw” in men and liked about men. It was very interesting. Some of the time the man and the woman agreed, for instance discussing shoulders and back muscles. Some of the time, the man weirded out the woman too, like when he talked about the virtues of the balls. Well, I think the same happens here. No matter how hard anyone of us tries to explain, I don’t think it is really possible to understand what we see unless you see it too. That said, I will try. In simple words, the little girl form is the most beautiful creation in the universe. There are many things I consider beautiful. But none is as beautiful as the little girl. And not just physically – also mentally, spiritually, emotionally; in body and mind as the Classics would say. And together with beautiful, in this case at least, comes sexually appealing. Because I see it as so beautiful that sexual activity with her, giving her pleasure and almost merging our souls is a tribute to her. In the same way an environmentalist sees the preservation of a lake, or a museum curator sees the restoration of its paintings as a tribute to their beauty, I see my attraction, physical, emotional and mental alike as a tribute to the little girl. Physically, what do I see?? Their hair is soft and smells nice. Might be wild, uncombed or dirty – all the same, it’s soft and smells nice. Their eyes are brighter and have a spark of life, imagination and curiosity unmatched. Their faces are sweeter and automatically joy-inducing. Their noses look like a speck of star dust. Their lips are brighter and seem made for kissing and being kissed. Their smile is happier and truer. Their voice is sweeter, clearer, more sincere and more musical. Their ears are all small, and pretty like made by a jeweller with a magnifying glass. Their heads are large, like wanting to fly. Their neck is tender and inviting, yet fragile, and still, like made to kiss. Their nape is perfect for holding her head while she sleeps. Their neck, collar, upper back and shoulder bones are perfect, proportionate and carefully sculpted to convey the feeling of a masterpiece of art. Their arms are thin, just thin enough to kiss all over, and just long enough to hug you around. Their hands are the best work of art and engineering ever, with all their fine details and textures, their softness, their intricately calculated proportions… Their armpits are not just hairless, but soft, ticklish and teasing. Their backs are the fusion between practicality and design, and still inviting to be massaged and cared for. Their chests, if flat, are inviting and welcoming. Their budding boobs, if not flat anymore, are a hymn and an affirmation to life and to its power and to its beauty and to its potentiality. Their tummy is soft but firm, and invites to be caressed. Their navel is just there, tempting and defiant, like a girl is, at that, and pointing to unity and autonomy, to independence and interdependence. Their butt is the softest, squeeziest cushion ever possible. Their genitalia are peaceful and anti-baroque. Their thighs are strong and restless. Their knees are finely tuned, and fragile, and careful. Their calves are tight and slim and shapely. Their ankles are slender and bony and again a modern sculpture that asks to be caressed. Their feet are soft and delicate and intricate. Their toes are funny, wiggly, almost alive by themselves. And all of the above is sexy like nothing else in the world. - If a pedophile molests/has sex/tries to have sex/takes nude pics of a LG *I'm not talking about a teen here, I'm talking about a child*, do you think that is a correct behaviour? Or s/he should go to jail? Why? Where do you trace the no-no line? Would it be different if it wasn't illegal or you trace it there thinking about the children and not just the law? OK those are too many questions together. I will answer them all, but I won’t respect your order because it doesn’t sound natural to me. Where do I trace the line? De facto, I trace it at never becoming acquainted with any girl. Because de jure, or at least ethically speaking, I don’t think I, LGsinmyheart should trace any line. It should be always up to her where we go and where we don’t. If she wants more, I will not stop her, and if she wants less, I will gladly stop. But because I don’t want to be put in such a position that I have to choose between respecting her wishes and respecting the law, I prefer not to have any girls in my life. Would it be different if it wasn’t illegal? Yes, it would. If it wasn’t illegal, I wouldn’t refrain from meeting girls, because then there is no choice between respecting her and respecting the law. Do I trace it there thinking about the children or just the law? Ethically speaking, I only think of the children and not the law. I would respect any limit she put, no matter whether it was well short of any legal requirement. But conversely, if she wants to go further than the law allows, I don’t think it is my place to deputise myself and tell her No. If… A paedophile molests a child? They should go to jail, with the only limitation that the child themselves must be able to set what the harshest possible punishment can be, even overriding maximum allowed penalties. But in my book molestation should grant jail or a similar punishment. A paedophile has sex with a child? This would greatly depend on two things. First, whether the child themselves wanted it or not or how far. Second, what the specific activity involved is in terms of risk of harm or actual harm caused, because if you hurt a child through sex it shouldn’t be seen any differently to hurting them through any other means that never involved sex, for instance. But if it is consensual, as this sub-question implies, then I, essentially, see it as correct and no admissible grounds for state intervention. A paedophile tries to have sex with a child? This depends on what “try” means, apart of course from not having achieved to. If the paedophile in the end refrained because they understood the child’s negative, then I see no reason for law to intervene. If they tried and couldn’t, not because they were respecting a child’s No, but because someone or something prevented it while they were not intending to respect the child’s wishes, then yes, it deserves jail, again subject to the child’s veto on the maximum penalty. A paedophile takes nude pics of a child? Again, this depends on the child’s own wishes. It should not be illegal if the child wants to, but obviously should if the child is forced to. It is also a very murky area when you consider two things: first, free distribution: I don’t think it’s ethical to distribute pics without the child’s explicit approval, but I am, really, not sure if it should grant jail (rather than compensation fees, for instance); and second: paid distribution: It is by no means ethical to make money that way without the child’s explicit approval and without explicitly giving the child the largest share of the proceeds, and if this is not the case, then yes, law should intervene to correct this, and probably to jail the photographer. - Are you sexually attracted to other people/things/whatever or just LG? If the answer is yes, do those interests have anything in common with the one discussed here? Why? Rarely. I am almost completely “exclusive”. But there are two cases. First, when I fall for a little girl but she ages out of my normal age of attraction, in most of the cases (but not always) I remain attracted to her even as an adult. However, I just have never fallen for women or late teens I never knew before. Second, I am very occasionally attracted to boys aged right at the onset of puberty, between, roughly, 11 and 13. But it’s rare – for instance, just for purposes of comparison, randomly in my daily life without doing anything outside my normal schedules and whereabouts, I spot a boy I think is sexy about once every two months; whereas there is no single day I don’t spot a girl I think is sexy. The things they have in common are pretty straightforward to me. The women I met as girls, in a way, I still see them as girls. Moreover, in the minority that I am no longer attracted to, you can see how they are the least “girlish” of all, the ones that have most changed since they were the age they were when I knew them – and I don’t mean physically. As for the boys, I think the attraction is pretty similar – I recognise about the same legal and ethical and social issues in being attracted to boys that age. At the same time, it is also, like with girls, a full attraction not just physical but also emotional and mental – I think that is the only age at which boys, asking themselves their role in life in new and different ways, have more in common with girls. And while physically they are not similar at all (despite common belief, most paedophiles would be able to tell apart a girl from a boy without looking under their undies and without resorting to “cultural” clues such as long hair or clothes or any such thing. Except of course extreme cases where the child does achieve an androgynous look – but those are possible for adults too), I also find boys at that age to have some specific features that I think are very sexy. And just at that age – because of how those are years when bodily changes are faster. Interestingly, though, while I have a sexual attraction, my sexual thoughts are “tamer” than what they are with girls at a similar stage of development. I also take that as a pointer that it’s weaker. Thank you for your time, your answers and for reading this really long post. If I or anyone else managed to inform you about something you didn’t know, or assuage your fears, or getting you more interested in learning about us, then it was well worth it. If not, well in that case there is still nothing else I can do about it, so we will have to let it be.  |
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