Re: I HATE hearing news like this....

That's in theory.

In real laws, children are actually treated as property of either. Don't believe me?? Check your codes!! Specifics may vary, sometimes take opposite positions in different countries, but it's true everywhere in the world.

And:

Are you very very sure???

'cause that's just not what's happening...

I don't disagree with these point, and I intended to put in a stipulation to that effect. But it's irrelevant to my point. This stewardship idea is what is widely intended by our system, even if parents and government fall wildly short of it much of the time. But then, they always do, don't they? Ah, humans.

Tu quoque.

You are showing you can contradict Goethe without fallacious resource; do it and you'll be all the stronger for that.

Fair enough. However, my accusation of hypocrisy and/or ineffectualness in that respect was not calling into question the rightness or wrongness the point itself and was not intended to. I do think it's safe to assume that, if a person claims to or tends to act in complete opposition to what he claims to believe, then it weakens his intentions for arguing it. It doesn't invalidate the factuality of the claim, no, but it does make one pretty suspicious. To my thinking, either he's not being entirely honest with his claims or he doesn't really know what he's talking about, or both. That should at least cast doubt on the correctness of the claim.

In any case, he devolved into ad hominems and angry ranting in short order, and therefore has already toppled his house of cards. I see no reason to continue discussing the matter with him.